If you grew up in a family that valued thinness and diets… and then went on to diet yourself for YEARS – your brain is now set up to think of food as series of rules and steps to follow.
Then enters Intuitive Eating with all its messages to: “jUsT LisTeN to YouR BoDy” and “eAt WHaT yoU wAnT”. Especially if you are a black-and-white thinker who *LOVED* the structure of dieting, this new world of Intuitive Eating can feel terrifying.
If you’re sure that you’re done with diets, but still struggle to trust yourself to be “responsible” with the flexibility of Intuitive Eating – we’re going to talk about how you can move forward.
In this episode, Melissa’s client Meg shares her experience as a WW “lifer”, her reaction to finding Intuitive Eating for the first time, how she approached things on her own vs. with a coach, how she let go of need for rules by inviting “healthy structure” into her IE journey. This episode will help you think about the best ways for you to learn intuitive eating based on your own preferences for structure and support. WE LOVE A GOOD CLIENT STORY! I’d love to hear your takeaways after hearing Megan today! Just message me on Instagram @no.more.guilt – I always love connecting with you between episodes.
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This episode was sponsored by No More Guilt with Melissa Landry. Reminder that though we are dietitians, we’re not *YOUR* dietitian. Podcasts don’t constitute treatment. If you have concerns about your dieting behaviors, seek out guidance from a medical or mental health professional. And if you’re looking for the process, support, and focus you need to live life without food guilt apply for a coaching program from today’s sponsor. No More Guilt with Melissa Landry is currently enrolling clients into 1:1 programs, group programs, and, recently added a do-it-yourself learning format: the Ex-Dieter’s Guide to No More Guilt.
how to reframe your lifelong diet mindset with Megan C [Melissa’s client] transcript
Melissa Landry 0:02 Hi there, I'm Melissa, a registered dietitian specialize in intuitive eating for on again off again, chronic dieters, and I'm here to help you take the guilt and stress out of eating so you can be the first in your family to break the diet cycle. I'm interested in helping you unlearn generational diet trauma, so you can be who you are without food guilt. Be sure to follow on Instagram at no more guilt for more support between these episodes. Are you ready? Let's jump in. Today, we have my client, Meg, who is here to share a little bit more about her journey and her story becoming an intuitive eater. Before we jump into our conversation, Meg, can you introduce yourself? Tell us a little bit about you. Meg 0:49 Hi, I'm Megan. I'm a stay at home mom of two. My kids went back to school today. Know pretty early. Wow. I was a teacher at my previous life and started my intuitive eating. I probably started thinking about it and exploring it in December of 2021. And I would say I've been on this journey now since January. Melissa Landry 1:23 How did you first find intuitive eating? Do you remember? Meg 1:27 If I had to guess, I think it was probably social media. You know, tick tock just fills your feed whatever with whatever it thinks you might like. And I think I stumbled across somebody there. And then once you like, you know, listen for a few seconds, it starts throwing more at you. Actually, that's probably not even true. Well, I did discover it on social media. But I discovered it through a friend with regards to an account for letting your children be intuitive eaters, okay. And I never really connected that it could be something for adults, because I just saw this one account and then started seeing more towards everybody. Melissa Landry 2:10 So parenthood is such a force. I feel like when people are preparing to become parents, when they are eventually parents, that's often a thing that can drive them to explore stuff that they maybe haven't before. And I do hear that very often, where people are like, oh, wait a minute, I can't just tell them to have a healthy relationship with I also need to have a healthy relationship with food. So when I was a dietitian, and I learned about intuitive eating, do you know what my reaction was? No, I was like, this is some woowoo bananas stuff. Like at first I was very resistant. Because I had been trained. I grew up in diet culture, go to the family of diet culture, I was trained in a way that diets were the law and they work if you just stick with them. So I had a very parallel processes a professional when I first saw it, and then the more I started listening, and linking it to my own experiences with myself with clients, it started to click was it like that for you to do first? Meg 3:10 I don't think I had resistance to it. But I do feel like every time I explain what I'm doing to somebody else, they look at me like a hippie. Which part of me is a proud hippie but but I think people do look at you like what are you doing? Melissa Landry 3:26 It's so foreign from everything. We've learned this trust in your body piece, which is the core of it, it feels like jumping off the deep end in the beginning for a lot of people. So how, what made you sort of resonate with the message is it wasn't your kids and wanting his show them? How was it something in your own life? Why did you keep pursuing him? Meg 3:45 I think it was twofold. I mean, my daughter was probably the biggest catalyst I had personally kind of burnt out of dieting. i It's funny when you look back on it, right? Hindsight is 20 Hindsight is 2020. But I've always gone through phases of dieting. And it's like, you know, you hit it hard for like a good year, and you're like this is it changed my habits. That's the old weightwatchers you know, Mom tried, it's a lifestyle and you feel like I've got the lifestyle. Now I can have the cake. And then you go off of the program for a little bit. And then that's, you know, when my energy was spent, and I was like, Alright, I'm taking a break, and I'll get back to it after the holidays. And it's kind of funny looking back on it as these like, ebbs and flows of, I can do it. I need a break, I can do it. I need a break. So I had definitely hit a phase where I was like, I just don't have the energy for this. And it had been several months of not having the energy. And it wasn't like I was like, Oh, I'm looking forward to being back on the diet. It was like Nope, still not there. And then at the same time I was noticing my daughter and her Her attitudes toward food. And like, for instance, I remember last Halloween, we were walking down the street with friends after doing like a trunk or tree and my daughter's like, Can I have some eye candy, I'm like, Sure. And I looked over two blocks later, and she had eaten as much of it as she could, and that one. And my son had had a piece and was kind of done with it. And it really kind of sparked like, oh, man, she is modeling a lot of what she'd seen me do. And I don't want that for her. And so she was kind of my catalyst. But it was kind of the perfect storm for me. Melissa Landry 5:38 Call it a lifestyle, but it felt it felt very temporary for you, you were planning on it being temporary, as you describe that, like I'll do this for a little while. And then when I can't take it after I white knuckle, that will be reprieve and then I'll pump myself up again, that's a really great way to describe what it can feel like on that cycle. Meg 5:56 I think that, like a lot of those diets don't target the behaviors or the reasons behind it, like Intuitive Eating does, you know, like, I always thought I would, I would get to my goal weight and then not be tempted by the sweets. Or you know what I mean? Like this lifestyle would somehow magically happen. And it never uncovers all of the reasons why those behaviors are there in the first one, Melissa Landry 6:20 right, that taps into so many assumptions. Like we think like, people just they don't like sweets. They don't. There's this like whole wrapped up idea we have what it means to be in a smaller body, which may or may not be true for you or for other people that you see. So you had a little work to do to unravel that part. For Intuitive Eating even makes sense in your mind. At some point. Meg 6:43 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, if there was a lot more work to be done than just losing the weight. Like there is on diet programs. Melissa Landry 6:52 Though true, so many people don't. And even people who are, quote, successful for a little while will say, you know, my body image still isn't intact the way that I want it to be, or I do still struggle with food. So weight is definitely not a measure of someone's relationship to food or their health. It's a really important message to keep repeating within yourself, because your brain is going to try to snap and tell you that no, no, this then this will bring you all the solutions to your problems. Maybe not. I think many people have found that to be true. Meg 7:21 Yeah. I think that I was thinking about this this morning as I was getting ready. I think diets can get you where you want, temporarily, and we always think it's a permanent thing. And intuitive eating for me has been much more long standing much more. I don't know like you said it's not the rubber band snap. Melissa Landry 7:47 That's heartbreaking, though. Right? Like we think that diets are gonna be the thing and then they're not that heartbreak happens over and over again. When did you start dieting? When When did that all start for you? Meg 7:58 Oh, man. Um, I think there's I could so I can remember moments when I started some disordered behaviors. Like I remember in high school once going through a phase of eating like only salads, and running on the treadmill a lot. And I remember that really vividly. In my mind. I think the first time I ever went on like a program to diet was my sophomore year after my sophomore year of college, and I had put on some weight. And my mom had been a Weight Watchers go or my whole life. So I started doing Weight Watchers meetings with my mom. So that's probably the first time I started something. regimented, and Weight Watchers has really been the only diet I've done my whole life. I'm not. I haven't bounced around to a ton of fats. I did try juice cleanse once. I will never do that. Again. I'm not a juice person. Melissa Landry 8:56 said back in such a cackle that made me really understand I'm never doing that again. Meg 9:03 I don't even enjoy juice. So I'm not sure why I thought this one time, it would be different and my teeth were fuzzy. Melissa Landry 9:12 For sure, yes. Oh my gosh. Oh, I know I well, that idea that like you, you felt discomfort in your body. You saw your mom doing Weight Watchers. It's a known brand. We hear about it, it's trusted. You know what that makes sense at the time to say okay, and that's how I culture positions. The whole thing is if you're unsatisfied with your body, then fix it. Instead of like, if you're unsatisfied and you're with your body, explore why that might be before engaging in these externalized things that aren't that motivating. aren't that joyful or that sustainable, so made sense that you weren't up there and kind of kept returning to that trusted what was a trusted brand for you at the time? Meg 9:54 And it worked. I mean, I could tell you now I know how to lose weight. It's just a matter Have it's never been permanent. It's been, you know, it's been long lasting for maybe a couple years. And then I'll have to do it again or I don't know. I think the the interesting part for me with Weight Watchers was it, it was it was always preached as healthy. I couldn't, it was easier for my mind to see flaws and other diets than it was to see it in Weight Watchers, I could see the flaws in a juice cleanse, I can see the flaws in some a diet telling you not to eat fruit. Like that didn't make sense to me. So So Weight Watchers was always pushed as like the healthy way. And it's just kind of funny how these slow? Are these these subtle behaviors that aren't smart or healthy, really sneak up on you and become part of your daily life without you realizing it? Melissa Landry 10:49 Very tricky. What were some of the things you noticed in Weight Watchers, maybe at the time, or maybe it's just now like the hindsight 2020? Like you say, like, what are some of the things you think, are positioned as healthy from weightwatchers, quote, healthy, but in retrospect, probably weren't for you personally. Meg 11:07 So one of this is the program has shifted a lot. I've done it for 15 years now. I will say one of the things that always struck me was I love nuts and seeds I always have, and they are nutritious. They energize me, they satisfy me, they full me. And they were always a way to just crush your day, a handful of nuts with like, a quarter of my day gone. And I was like, This is insane. This is it made you you made your mind challenge what was healthy. And now that I'm out of that, it's it's like that I always knew that was healthy. I always knew that was nutritious. But Weight Watchers telling me it would eat up a quarter of my daily points was like, telling me it wasn't healthy. Or another one was smoothies. I love smoothies. I always felt like it was a really good snack for me. And especially if I was like not in a mood to eat protein or produce that day. It was like a really fun way to eat produce. And Weight Watchers was like no, can't do that. Not approved, right or a good way to crush. I think I looked it up once. And this was years ago. But it was like a movie was like nine points. But if you ate each piece of fruit individually, it was zero. I was like What Melissa Landry 12:28 a strange game of chess that's happening all day long. Yeah, well, you're Meg 12:37 good way to make you not like the food. Yeah, yeah, why don't eat the banana. Melissa Landry 12:42 There's punishment associated with absolutely and then we can talk in a bit too about some of the work you did around like making you have a strong desire to do the right thing and to follow through and you have that integrity as a person. And that would sometimes get woven in and I feel many people with that personality trait in those values weightwatchers taps into that in a weird way where everything becomes like a moral exercise everything becomes a like a failure or a success which can really great at you throughout the day or throughout your weeks that's hard thing to constantly be living with. Meg 13:16 Yes, yes. Melissa Landry 13:17 The other thing it trains you to do is D prioritize your body cues you said with the nuts It always made you feel energized you could notice the satisfaction you're telling it had staying power for you. These are concepts we really learned to label in the program. I love hearing you talk that way now. We want you to at the time was like yeah, all that data doesn't matter actually. Like those things that you feel don't matter. What matters is what we say which conditions you to start silencing and suppressing those cues. Which is why when many people come off Weight Watchers and they say I'm gonna try intuitive eating on day one. Spoiler alert, you're not going to be like oh my feel all my sensation. It's not gonna come like a wash over you. There's gonna need to be some practice. So was that true for you? Did you find it was hard in the beginning to really not just here but trust what your body was saying after weight watchers? Meg 14:10 Yeah, I think that's something I'm still honing in on two. I think that'll probably be something we can all do for our whole lives is really like connect more with our bodies and continually do that. But I do think that was one of the big not not surprises, but like something I had to learn through intuitive eating that just because an intuitive eating snack doesn't mean it's, it's gonna come easy, because we've silenced our cues for so long. You know, I ignored my hunger for so long or I silenced satisfaction. And so we have to unlearn all of that stuff. And that was really eye opening for me because I just kind of thought it would happen. and, and and it doesn't happen overnight. It definitely, you start to feel it as you practice intuitive eating, and it definitely comes back. But it's not an instant, you know? Yeah, behave behavior, I guess. Melissa Landry 15:14 I'm like still rattling what you just said, just because it's natural doesn't mean it's easy. That was so powerful. And this, this ability within us is definitely there. It's there when we're born. You know, you talk about your kids, kids have an easier time, so long as they're not conditioned. And you know, as they get old decondition as they're older. Just because it's natural does not mean it's going to happen overnight. So why do we think it's going to happen overnight? Why do you think most people who jump into ie are expecting overnight success or else their failure? Meg 15:46 That's a good question. I don't know. I think I mean, we I have seen an intuitive eater, I have a friend that's never dieted at a day in her life. And it looks easy. But I also think she didn't have to unlearn things that I do. I also think we just have this perception of like, you know, I've heard it referred to a lot of people confusing, intuitive eating with the hunger fullness diet. And that really spoke to me because I think I had an expectation that that would be such a huge component of it is hunger, fullness, and there's just so much more. It's not like if that word intuitive eating, if it was the hunger, fullness, I think. And there weren't all these other things mixed into listening to your hunger and fullness, like satisfaction, and what you know, energizes you and all of these other pieces, maybe it would be easy, would not be a nice world to live in. Melissa Landry 16:42 Very simple. We just haven't done hunger fullness. And what you're referring to, for anyone who's newer to Intuitive Eating is the integration or the use of all of the 10 principles, intuitive eating offers. And what people find is that different principles have different priorities for them at different times. Sometimes you're leaning more on one or the others, we talk a lot about when to switch when you're you're like leaning on one a little bit too hard, and it's just not working for you that might be assigned to switch. So part of the practice is not just mastering the individual skills, but figuring out which ones to use when you need them. So tell us about that process. For you Meghan, what was it like to say, this is more of like a soft skill than a operational skill diets or operational skills do this on this day, at this time in this particular way, A to B, not the case with IE, how was it for you to switch into that learning style? Meg 17:36 very hard. That's why I say if I could, if I wanted to, I could probably lose weight tomorrow, because I know how to lapse, I know how to follow steps, I know how to follow up program. And I really relate to I like when things are black and white, and clear. That's just so that's how my brain works. Um, so it was really a lot of exploration to learn these soft skills, I will say it was hugely beneficial for me to have you, it was hugely beneficial for me to have the group coaching, which is the program that I did with you to hear, I think to hear the other skills people were working on to I knew them, I'd read the book, I know them in the back of my mind. But when you see how they relate to other people's journeys, they click a little bit differently. And so like the self care piece was one that somebody else had brought up in our group coaching. And I always have thought I was good at self care. And I do think I'm good with balance. But I am not good at recognizing or acknowledging my feelings, I would say, and just the simple fact of writing them down, kind of unlocked a door for me. And so it was I had to, I had to listen to other people's journeys. I had to explore them and try out these soft skills and see which ones fit. Because I think in the beginning, I have really leaned on the hunger fullness piece, and then you go there must be something else. Because you know, Melissa Landry 19:16 it's not it's not clicking with that alone. And not that those skills hurt. I like to think about working into intuitive eating like the the journeys of black and white, you're not like a dieter or an intuitive eater, there is something called risk reduction. So if someone's are ready to do the full suite of intuitive eating skills, and they want to maybe pull a little bit off of calories and fat and all that kind of tracking stuff more toward hunger fullness, it's not going to give them full relief, the way that you are starting to find with more skills, but it's going to start them and getting that relief start them and giving you experiences. So if you're like oh I unfortunately we're in the hunger fullness diet right now. That's okay. Like, you can sometimes use imperfect experiences or Are people telling me this is the wrong way? But I just got to do it. Yeah. Okay. Right, some of us have to learn that way we have to, we have to look under the rock ourselves. So, gosh, it's just so fascinating, have different people take it on. That's why I love doing this work, because everybody has a different way of looking at it and thinking about it that makes it really exciting. Meg 20:19 Yeah. And I think that's part of the connectivity piece, too. Like, if you know, I have to stick with this particular piece of it for now, that's connected to your body. Right? That's you knowing right now, this is what I need. Or, you know, I'm not ready for something else just yet. And so I think that's, that's the journey, right is Melissa Landry 20:43 autonomy piece, when think about why do folks burnout on diets is because there is absolutely no autonomy. As you have a teaching background, right, you understand that? younger, younger people have different autonomy needs than older people, it looks a little different. But if a learner doesn't feel autonomous, it's not sticking, they're not going to want to pay attention, they're not going to want to be around the information to integrate it into their brain. That's just learning science. And so anytime you feel stuck, or like closing in, we've got to figure out how to reintroduce choice and autonomy. And that was the part that you used so well with the group. Whenever you got stuck. You were like, Oh, I actually really liked my group. I admire them. They're, they're like normal people. And I like what they're doing with that. Okay, that inspired you to think of new things and try new things. And they felt the same way about you and you were sharing your experiences. So that's super powerful way more than a book could ever offer. Meg 21:44 Yes, the community piece is a game changer. Melissa Landry 21:49 You said you had one friend who you like think of as a natural intuitive eater? Do you have any other folks in your life who you would say, are intuitive eaters? Meg 21:58 No, I will say this one friend always comes to mind. My husband was an intuitive eater, telling me married me, and I think I have been a bad influence on him. And now I'm doing that to heat. But he's always said like, it's so funny to me when people are like, I'm not really a sweets person. And I'm like, what? I can't relate to that at all. And so he's probably the this the next closest, intuitive eater. I know. It's kind of wild, how much diet cultures around you that you don't even know. And that isn't always labeled as a diet. Melissa Landry 22:42 Yeah, you know, similar to Weight Watchers feels like most people are like, that's a great program. Good job. Or, oh, try Weight Watchers, you know that that would be an example of something that people don't really, or we hear sentence like, oh, well, she's just practicing balance. Let's just moderation. codewords kind of slipping to rebrand or soften because I do think most people have a negative connotation with dieting by now maybe not everybody, but most people are starting to catch on that. That doesn't feel like the right way to do it. It's just so the whole thing's ik the whole thing is so hard. Meg 23:19 If and it's funny how many different words there are to avoid that word, diet, cleanse, moderation. That's a big one. Balance. Yeah, it's just kind of funny. When you start. You start seeing it all around you. Melissa Landry 23:37 It's everywhere. So at this point, now, you started with some self study, you'd like discovered intuitive eating, you started doing some things on your own. You invested in a group program, what would you say are some of the things that are improving or different now compared to maybe when you first found intuitive eating? Meg 23:57 Well, I think my whole goal has always been food freedom. I remember saying this once, when I was starting weight watchers again, after, I think my second baby and I remember looking at my mom and saying, This is the last time I'm gonna get the power back from my food relationship. And that didn't happen. No matter how much weight you lose, or that I lost, and I think I have, I'm definitely feeling that freedom. I look at my husband brought doughnuts this weekend. And I get to keep going back to the box and like, guiltily eating another bite. I had to it was wonderful. And I was kind of done with it after that, and that's revelational for me. So that's one of my favorite foods, and it's definitely freeing to be able to enjoy them and feel satisfied and not feel tempted is not the right word, but to not feel like they have the power I had cookies from, we have a crumble cookies nearby. I don't know if you've had them. They're delicious. And I had him for lunch the other day. And that was freeing to be like, I don't know, to break these rules, I grew up with your lunch, then have the dessert. It was freeing to be like, but this is what I want. And I had it and I had it until I was sad. And I wasn't like, I really should balance that out with a carrot. It's just autonomy. And it's feeling in control of what feels good. And having the control in the relationship. Melissa Landry 25:37 Yeah. And ultimately, that leads to calm, that leads to more more calm and peace in your day that you can use to focus on other things. If you're in your home and spending half an hour going don't get doughnuts, get doughnuts, maybe just to like maybe just a bite, no, half a bite. Okay, one more bite. But that's it. That is the tape that's playing in your head, where you're not resting and restoring, you're not noticing something about your life or your home or your family or that you might be able to nurture or grow the way you want to. So that's exciting to hear. Meg 26:07 I think it's similar with like, the body piece to one of the big changes I made was buying clothes that fit better. And it's the same thing. It's funny how you don't recognize that when clothes don't fit you well, those thoughts of like, this is pinching where I don't like it, or does this look terrible when I sit like this are just constantly revolving in your head and they consume so much of your energy. So it's the same concept Melissa Landry 26:35 our program describes, Well, first we talk about creating focus, and coming up with your individual values. Freedom is a word that every time I prompt you Meghan, you're like it's freedom. Again, Melissa started asking, it's always freedom. Like, it's always what she wants, which is wonderful, because I think that did help to simplify your process. It made it much easier for you to whenever we might have gotten stuck, or we weren't sure what the next step was, that was always a clarifying word for you. So that's always step one in our program. But step two, step two is really working through the diet mindset and trying to turn the volume on that as quietly as we can, while we're together, then you can start to do a little more work with Yes, hunger, fullness, but also with emotional coping, which you stepped into with satisfaction which you continue to enjoy and explore. So that process, there's a lot going on, how did you? How did you get through that in a focused way in an organized way and not get overwhelmed? Meg 27:35 I think I did get overwhelmed at times. But that's why the community piece of it was so important. And I do think the touchstone of like, what's my end goal was always enough to, or always so important to bring me back to like, this doesn't have to be so overwhelming. Simplify. What are we working on now? Because I think, I think in our minds, in my mind, I wanted it to be a quick process, be an intuitive eater, it's natural. This should come so easily and quickly. And then I'll be set and and so finding my place on the journey and not rushing, it was really crucial to keeping me from being overwhelmed. A lot of the time, there were moments, you know, of course, everybody goes through ebbs and flows of emotions. And it helps me to have that long term touchstone of what am I doing this for? And that was so helpful for you and the community to, to bring it back to okay, what can we focus on right now? To help you feel like we're working toward that long term goal? Melissa Landry 28:42 Right? process? What is the strategy structure? Where am I within that process? How far have I gotten within that process so you can goalpost and milestone what's happening. And the third was support. Thank you for saying that. It was overwhelming sometimes, because I don't know that we talk about that part enough on social media or if it's hard to glean, that that feeling may come up through the intuitive eating process. That's a normal thing when you are pushing and unlearning that that kind of feeling what our job is to learn to relate to that differently. Our job is to learn to see that and say, Okay, I'm either pushing too fast, or I'm working on a mismatched thing right now. The overwhelm isn't bad. It's a signal like everything else. So you have to learn that at some point. Or else you will get only as far as you can go by yourself. That's that's, that's the nature of the process. Meg 29:38 Yeah, for me with the case too. I could do so much on my own. But the community paced and having moving beyond that was what the group coaching really helped me with and I think like even, you know, hearing people on the podcast, it was really interesting to me when I did have an overwhelming feeling or a few days and It wouldn't be my week in group coaching. But just being part of it, it was like this huge rush of like, oh man, okay, take a step back. Just hearing other people and getting them listening to you give them support. It relates to your journey to somebody. Melissa Landry 30:19 I've done several designs for the group coaching, you did the gentle nutrition intensive, which is a six week intensive that I do periodically. That one has a steel, hotseat style coaching, which means one week you have it, and then the other week you're observing, you know, we have kind of two groups that that alternate on that. And then other times, I've had everybody go every single week, but that's such an interesting idea to balance like action and reflection in your journey, right? So some weeks you might be more organizing, coming up with goals really going after them. And then other times just letting yourself coast through those goals rather than tinkering, tinkering, tinkering, that seemed to actually by design sort of help you to like push, and coast and push and coast and make sure that this wasn't a fatiguing experience that you could change gears if you wanted to, at any time. Meg 31:10 Yeah. And I think it was helpful to have two weeks to really sit in a strategy or a goal or a focus, and I could change it, and sometimes I did. But I think I think the weeks that it was my turn to be in the hot seat, I felt a push to, I don't know, show progress or have a new goal. I'm working on it. And so it's nice to post and listen to other people's and remind you to not rush the process. Melissa Landry 31:39 If you guys are thinking about support out there, that is a good question to ask yourself is like, Am I an urgent person? I am. Melissa is the most urgent person listening to things done yesterday. It benefits me too. I call it make it slower. So I tell myself sometimes I'm like make it slow work masa, because I'm always wanting to finish it. I was a kindergarten I was that first that kid was like, done. I did my rush up into my homework and wait for the teacher, girl, Melissa, and then all the answers were freaking wrong. Because I just wasn't so excited to pass in my paper like this is deep undercurrent for me. So for some learners, if you know that that urgency, which has to do with uncertainty, you don't know what's gonna happen with intuitive eating? Right? You don't know. You don't know a die. It's either but you think you do. So it creates a false certainty. That false certainty weren't. We're taking it away as we do intuitive eating. Meg 32:39 Yes. That's a hard. That's a hard piece two is that like, it's not a lack of control. But it is more handing over the reins to your body instead of crossing your mind. Melissa Landry 32:52 Yeah, many of us are not practiced in and that's, that's not a deficit or a bad thing about you. It's just a way of thinking. And so when you go to learn this, if you if you're saying yes, okay, I can see the process and why it works and how it works. I can see other people are doing this, do think thoughtfully about your learning style. For the people you hear on the podcast that were in group, they were motivated by storytelling and role modeling and community connection. They were motivated by structure and by help slowing themselves down in a way that didn't feel like no no movement at all. Right? That's a balance too. But that's a great point that the urgency helps it to feel scary. Yeah, and get it done fast and the uncertainties over but if Meg 33:37 we have a box to check, right, did that did that like that, I think that constantly thought out the program. And there is no program Melissa Landry 33:48 programs kind of a loose term Meg 33:52 thought out but I don't know I like I like we talked about this at the beginning. I like order. And knowing this, this and this will get me here. Beautiful, intuitive eating. It's it's a journey. Melissa Landry 34:07 And what you don't get my job I think of us as partners in this work, my job is to do my best to create some type of structure for you. So that that uncertain feeling that urgency, that anxiety, that's very normal, that overwhelm that's very normal. My job is to reduce that as much as humanly possible and make space for it to because I can't remove it entirely for you. That's something I had to learn when I started doing this work because of course I was like you know trying so hard to prevent people from extra suffering. But this is hard. This is hard and when you are in a coaching program, what can happen is sometimes different people have different needs for structure. And that's also my job to say okay, like, like it needs a little more this week or a little less this week and that was definitely part of it toward the end where I don't know if you notice I was kind of pushing you a little bit more to getting your goals in the middle and kind of Don't know, be a little bit more like a jazz musician, we talked about not being so literal with some of that. So tell me what was that like for you to be helped to, like, get more structure and then less structure over the course of the program. Meg 35:13 That was really profound for me. I remember the week you told me, you know, you know, the steps, I know, the components, and the end. Now I just need to, what did you tell me, you were like, Oh, it was like learning to play the piano. I know, the notes. Just feel the cadence of the song. And that was really revolutionary for me, because cuz I do rely on steps. And you know, like I mentioned black and white, I really enjoy feeling control. And so it's a bit scary when you put all your, you know, everything into body connectivity, but it's also really, it's a really great feeling to feel even the littlest bits of connectivity to your body and be like, oh, man, there that is a minute. Melissa Landry 36:11 You're spending good time with you. And maybe good time with you that you have never spent before especially folks that have dieted a long time. This is something that I had a client graduate just the other day, and she was like, I didn't even know what to tell you. I wanted because I could not imagine. I knew I wanted this feeling gone. But I couldn't imagine what that would feel like. And now I can tell you, that is the coolest thing. Right? Like, yeah, oh, now I have words or experience for this thing that I really wanted. Meg 36:42 Well, and I think diet, I don't know, it's we're so used to diets, or at least I am for so long, that it's hard to think outside of that check the box mentality. And so letting go of that is really that's what makes intuitive eating different, right. That's why That's why it's not a diet is because it's not a system or a process. And once you complete these tasks, you're an intuitive eater. Melissa Landry 37:07 Oh, although again, just because she's learning doesn't mean we don't wish it were true. And that's okay. But yeah, yeah. Thank you for sharing that. I don't know that I've ever had a conversation on the podcast about that aspect of like, going from the operational tasky. side over to the, you know, more soft skills, the more process the more intuitive side, that transition has a very specific feel. It's one of the reasons I love working with Umag. Because when I explained to you that transition, you got it. That was kind of like leaned on a definition or step get you out of Snopes. And I saw you start to challenge yourself and even check yourself and say, Okay, wait a minute, how can I, you did that through the course when you would read it, you would write these beautiful responses, and you just made the most of this program. So you kept that side of you. But you completely let it go in a totally different. So I just thank you so much for letting me be part of that. It was really awesome to see. Meg 38:04 Thank you. You were inspirational. Melissa Landry 38:08 So as we close here, is there maybe, you know, people are listening to this just like you were once is there one bit of advice or one takeaway you want them to hear from you in this conversation? Certainly lots of little nuggets were brought up, but what's maybe one thing you would tell someone on the fence or just starting out as you were back in 2021? Meg 38:30 I think my probably my biggest piece of advice, or most something that would have helped me is, is give it time. It's not a quick fix. And that's why it sticks. It's because you have to put in the work and and give, give yourself time to do that work. It's funny how I think that it you know, I was hoping it would be a quick fix coming off of 20 years of dieting. Like that's 20 years of behaviors and thoughts and diet culture that I've learned. And so I'm I had to figure out that I have to give myself that time to it's not going to take 20 years, hopefully. But I've been on this journey now for eight months. And I think it was probably around month six where I was like, okay, and intuitive eating, there's not an endpoint, you know, it's not like, done today. Today, I became an intuitive eater. It's a journey. It's a process and to just kind of ride the wave because it's it's a definitely a worthwhile one, but give it time. Melissa Landry 39:41 Yeah that's really good advice and probably validating for a lot of people who really want this or working hard at it. Not having full relief yet does not mean it's not working. It doesn't mean you're doing you know you're on the wrong path or you're a failure. It might just mean you need those things process support. structure. And that can be your work now after this podcast to reflect, do you have enough process to have enough support? Do you have enough structure? If yes, lean into that? If no find it, that would be the next step. And what Megan did very gracefully through her time in the program. Thank you so much for your time today was nice to hang out and just kind of have a more open ended Convo today. Meg 40:21 Thank you for having me. Melissa Landry 40:23 Oh, welcome. You have anything fun today? Or we just Meg 40:27 my husband just said, I canceled my afternoon. You want to go get lunch? I was like, what? Melissa Landry 40:34 I love this for you. Where you're from food freedom at that date. Meg 40:39 That's right. Melissa Landry 40:41 Is it well, and boy that I want you inside of our community. But thanks again for your time. Meg, Meg 40:47 thank you so much. Melissa Landry 40:49 Good morning, friends. Well, maybe it's not morning for you. It's morning for me. I'm sitting here drinking my coffee. I just edited Megan's episode. And I'm just thinking to myself, how often we use this word, journey. It can feel I don't know, sometimes like a loaded word. Because journey was what we would use before you embarked on your next weight loss endeavor. Right? Like people always describe their weight loss experiences, like the first time they were naive, they were excited, they assumed it would work. The second time, they're like, Alright, I guess I'll do this again. Come on, pump up, you can do it, you did it last time. By the third time, they're like, Okay, here we go. And by the fourth time, they can't even get through a day because the body remembers the mind remembers. So while I do agree, the word journey is appropriate for an intuitive eating experience, right, where we're on a path and a process and there's twists and turns and learnings and yada, yada, yada. I don't know that I want that connotation with intuitive eating because it does not feel like that. If any of you have a better word for what the intuitive eating experience is, I kind of want to hear it. Because I don't know if you think the same as I do that the word journey kind of as a branding problem based on the diet culture past. But at any rate, that's the word we'll use for now. It was made clear to me listening to Megan how important it is to know yourself know how you like to learn, and then set yourself up for that learning that you want to accomplish. It can make a huge difference in hitting the outcomes you want when it comes to being an intuitive eater. We talked a lot in this episode about my group program and in full transparency. I'm not enrolling for that one at the moment. That group is something that I offer periodically, when I have the bandwidth groups are very difficult to enroll, right, you got to get a lot of like minded people together at the exact same time. And so that's why I don't run them all the time. One to One coaching is my bread and butter. But the way that I create community that Megan found so much benefit in is by giving you access to my membership, which means that when we're doing our one to one calls, I also give you access to my course I give you access to a Facebook group with other learners. And I give you access to monthly office hours and monthly meetups. And so right now my one to one program is the best way to get the things, the process the support the structure that you might be craving right now. So if listening to Megan, you said to yourself, yeah, I'm as motivated as her. I haven't experienced just like her. What's been missing is a little bit of help along the way. You know, you have a home here. Anytime you're ready. I want you to apply for coaching. We can chat a bit more about what you're working on how I might help. And maybe someday you'll be on the podcast sharing your awesome tips with people. I hope so. Because I think sharing about this and helping each other out is the way that we're going to break the diet cycle so that nobody else has to struggle with this stuff. That would be the dream. Until next time, be good to your good body. Transcribed by https://otter.ai