Today we’re sitting down with Erin from @foodsciencebabe on Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok!
Many of you struggle with food rules centered on the idea of “clean eating”. You want to do the best for your health by choosing high quality foods, but is that really necessary for your best mental, emotional, and financial health? We know you want to do what’s right for your body without losing your mind – so we talk about what it means to “eat clean” and how to eat for your best health.
As a food scientist and food industry expert, Erin talks to us about:
- What inspired her to speak up about food safety misinformation on her page
- Why people seem to be obsessed with “Eating clean” – plus she shares her own personal journey letting go of biased beliefs about food
- What kinds of strategies influencers on social media use to “fear-monger” around food How you can be a critical consumer of science information to protect yourself from unnecessary “clean eating” food guilt
Dm us on Instagram after this episode to let us know your thoughts. What did this inspire you to do differently in your food freedom work?
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This episode was sponsored by No More Guilt with Melissa Landry. Reminder that though we are dietitians, we’re not *YOUR* dietitian. Podcasts don’t constitute treatment. If you have concerns about your dieting behaviors, seek out guidance from a medical or mental health professional. And if you’re looking for the process, support, and focus you need to live life without food guilt apply for a coaching program from today’s sponsor. No More Guilt with Melissa Landry is currently enrolling clients into 1:1 programs, group programs, and, recently added a do-it-yourself learning format: the Ex-Dieter’s Guide to No More Guilt.
what does it mean to “eat clean” anyway? with Erin from @foodsciencebabe transcript
Dalina Soto 0:02 Hola hola chulas Melissa Landry 0:04 Hi there. We are experts in intuitive eating for on again off again chronic dieters, and we are here to help you take the guilt and stress out of eating so you can become the first in your family to break the diet cycle, just like we are in our families. Dalina Soto 0:19 We want you to be who you are without food guilt. Melissa Landry 0:22 Be sure to follow us on Instagram. No more guilt for Melissa and your Latina nutritionist for Dalina. Dalina Soto 0:29 Are you ready? Let's break the diet cycle. Melissa Landry 0:32 Hey, it's me Melissa. Before we start, I want to let you know that this episode is brought to you by no more guilt with Melissa Landry. What you are about to listen to is not a professional coaching or counseling session. Each episode is a one time conversation meant for educational purposes. Look, we're dieticians. But we're not your dietician. Remember that podcasts don't constitute treatment. If you have concerns about your dieting behaviors, seek out guidance from a medical or mental health professional. And if you're looking for the process, support and focus you need to live life without food guilt apply for a coaching program from today's sponsor, me. I'm currently enrolling clients into one to one programs group programs and I recently added a do it yourself format the ex dieters guide to no more guilt apply for a program at Melissa Landry nutrition calm, I hope to meet you soon. Hola hola Chulas. Hi there. I am very excited for today's guests. We have Erin from food science babe which I know some of you follow her because you send me her videos sometimes asking follow up questions as you're doing your intuitive eating journey. And today we're going to talk about clean eating what that means why social media cause this to be a thing and how it gets us worried about food. Erin, thank you for being here. Do you mind introducing yourself a little bit before we jump in? Erin 1:53 Yeah, thanks for having me. So yeah, like she said, I come from food science space. So I have a bachelor's in chemical engineering from the University of Minnesota, I've worked in the food industry for over 10 years in both the conventional and organic sectors of the food industry. So I have experience working on different types of products, different size companies, really large companies, really small companies. And really, I just I started my page in 2018, I was really just sick of all of the false claims and misinformation that I was seeing, you know, not only surrounding nutrition, which I had seen, you know, there were quite a few dietitians that were already on social media, which was great. But I didn't really see anyone specifically like talking about like the food manufacturing side of things, food processing, that kind of stuff. So I just was like, I'm going to start a page, and I had absolutely no idea that it would even become something popular at all. And it just kind of blew up. And yeah, that's that's kind of how it started. Dalina Soto 2:56 You need it you. Yeah. Melissa Landry 3:00 Well, it's so interesting, because there is like an overlap in like food science training and dietetics training where we get like maybe a course or a semester in food science. So we kind of have the, the top layer of understanding, but I think you're right, there's such a need for that deep dive from a chemical perspective. You you provide so much education about that. Erin 3:18 Yeah, and I think too, I mean, it is a lot different to when you actually have worked in industry as well just like sort of understanding, like some of the misconceptions. It's like, No, I've worked in manufacturing facilities, like that's not true at all. And it's difficult even like, you know, you don't really learn that stuff necessarily in school either. So it's like, there are just so many things where it's it's these authorities, you know, people that like literally have never worked a day in the food industry. And they're just sharing all this misinformation, and people are just believing it. So yeah, I just felt like it was a gap that needed to be filled. And when I started I was I was a stay at home mom and sort of doing some consulting on the side, which I still do now but I was like, Well, I didn't really have time for it, but I was like I have a little bit of time. I didn't know it was gonna take up this much time when I started so I was like I have some time so I'll start this page and then it kind of Yeah, it got a little out of hand but Melissa Landry 4:10 and over the past couple years tik tok has really blown up which I think is almost I don't know you can tell me if you think it made it kind of worse some of the misinformation I feel like that bite size, controversy type of tone that comes up and tick tock has made it a little bit harder to figure out what's truth versus you know, misinformation? Erin 4:32 Oh, yeah, I think it's definitely made it more difficult just because it is really really difficult to communicate nuance in like a one minute to three minute video. When I first started it was only like one minutes. And now it's three minutes but you get more views if it's less time. So it's like trying to fit something into one minute and make it nuanced and still make it accurate. Like it's so difficult. So the things that get so much attention are just these things that are Basically confirming biases and then like, you know, they get millions of views. And then by the time someone like me sort of debunks it, it's like, it's been viewed so many times, and then my debunking gets, like, a few 1000 views. And it's like, okay, this is so frustrating. So that platform specifically, I feel like it really like pushes out that message, just because like, it's easy to watch a video that's like confirming biases. And that's not really difficult to understand. And so it's like a big game of telephone sometimes to like, if an account says, you know, there's all these accounts that are kind of like saying the same thing over and over again, and it's like false to begin with. And then it just like, gets even more false as it goes on. Well, frustrating. Melissa Landry 5:47 Yeah, the scientific process takes a super long time like to conduct a study, get it peer reviewed, send that out, get it validated that that is long form. And so tick tock is just taking like someone said this, and I heard it, so I'm going to repeat it. And so I it's kind of can't always keep up with how fast misinformation can can go for sure. Erin 6:08 Yeah, definitely. Melissa Landry 6:09 So you get the trolls sometimes as well, I'm sure people who are from that camp, how do you cope with that, you know, as someone not even intellectually as a scientist, as a person? What's that like for you to get so much? Yeah, Erin 6:24 it was, it was something I kind of had to learn like it was, it was a lot more difficult at the starting. I didn't really, you know, I was just like, trying to respond to like, every single comment, and I still try to respond to comments as much as I can. But I've realized it's like, not worth my time. A lot of the time, the Restrict feature on Instagram is great. So yeah, I mean, I do, I usually give people a couple of chances, you know, to, you know, I'll respond, but if somebody is, you know, being just mean, or, you know, I will block people, I will restrict people that, you know, I don't want my comment section to be a place where misinformation is spreading. So if I see something that's false, I'll respond to it. And I might just restrict that person. So like, they can't be spreading more misinformation. So yeah, I mean, I think it's just a balance between, like, not getting too caught up in it, but monitoring it to a point where you can make sure like, there isn't false information being spread in your comments to so no, Melissa Landry 7:26 I think when we see things that are different than what we believe are true, like people get very, like, there's this initial reaction, Delina and I see it on our pages. Delina more. So I feel like has some company company from folks that I get a lot the troll. Yeah, I can appreciate. Erin 7:43 I understand that reaction too. Because like, I actually used to believe like, my page, a lot of the things that I communicate are things that I used to believe at one point in time. So that's sort of why I am so passionate about it as well, because like, I used to believe these things I used to restrict my diet, you know, I used to have all these food rules based on these clean eating things that I believed and you know, believing organic was better and all these things. So, you know, I remember those times where I would have had that reaction of somebody was saying the things I'm saying now, so like, I also have to remind myself to when I get frustrated with people, like I understand where they're coming from, and like, I would have had that same reaction potentially in the past as well. But yeah, I mean, it does definitely get frustrating, too, though. Melissa Landry 8:31 Thank you for sharing that. Dalina Soto 8:32 Yeah. And I love that you say that, because that's something that we often talk about on this podcast that like, you could have believed something in the past and learned new information, and now have a whole new set of beliefs that are better for you and your mental health and your lifestyle. And it's okay to have believed do things in the past. There's no shame or guilt. Like, I think, I don't know if this I don't think you and I have ever had this conversation. But I also was like, very much like, Mom, you have to get everything organic. There's like hormones, everything, you know, cuz I feel like some of our education kinda like feels that a little bit. And then you come out into the real world and you're like, Wait a second. Wait, let's talk about this. Melissa Landry 9:17 There's a lot of nuance and context and all sorts of things we need to apply in our thinking. Yeah, yeah. So one thing I wanted to get your take on is kind of the backdrop where all this misinformation is spreading. So for us as intuitive eating dieticians, we see a lot of people influenced by the concept of clean eating. And I would say like, I don't know, for me, it was like the early 2000s, mid 2000s, where I started seeing a lot of that messaging, you know, we start thinking about like super foods and foods that have sort of extra special properties. And then we have these foods that are almost claimed as toxins on the other side of the spectrum. What is your take on this concept? Clean Eating, why do you think people get obsessed with that idea? Erin 10:04 It's yeah, I mean, I know for me, I would say I was obsessed with it for a while as well. And I think, I think it is just due to, obviously, the misinformation out there. And then just just sort of like, there is so much misinformation like fear, fear based where it's like, you're literally afraid of, for me, it was like buying conventional produce, you know, I would always like, make sure the Dirty Dozen I was buying organic, because I literally thought like it was poisoning me because it just the way it's communicated, is like, Oh, these things are just covered in pesticides, it's horrible for you. And in reality, I mean, that's not the case at all. But for me, like I actually bought less produce and ate less, because I was like, so afraid that it was just coated in pesticides. And so, you know, I think a lot of it just gets gets shared a lot because it's like fear sells. Not only is it being spread, you know, on social media, but it is a marketing strategy as well. I've worked at companies where it's been the marketing strategy, and it's frustrating that these I always think of Panera when I think of like, where clean eat, I don't know if that the origin was from them. But like, they have like a no no list, which is basically like our dirty ingredients. And so a lot of it I think comes from places like that companies sort of putting that out there Whole Foods, you know, there's, there's a whole list of ingredients that if your food contains specific ingredients, you literally can't sell it in Whole Foods. And there's no scientific basis to these lists, like clean doesn't mean safer. It doesn't mean healthier. So it's really just, I mean, it comes down to marketing, basically, and its appeal to nature. So appeal to nature, meaning people just in general tend to assume that natural equals safer. And that's, that's, that's all it comes down to is like playing off of that assumption that humans tend to make that like natural is safer and healthier, which isn't the case, some of the most toxic things we know are naturally occurring. And so it really just became a marketing strategy, it helped companies sell food, and it helped them potentially sell it for a higher price point as well. I mean, early on, I never really saw anyone, I was probably looking for information that confirmed my biases at the time, but I didn't really see anybody online like sharing stuff to refute it and things to, you know, counter it with science and stuff like that. So I hope now there is more of that than when I was sort of duped by the whole clean eating marketing. But yeah, I think it just it's it spreads because it's easy to understand whether you know whether it's true or not, it's easy to understand, it confirms biases, it makes people feel better or superior by eating clean, all those types of things. And I think one of the biggest things, too, that sort of made me switch, my mindset was becoming a mom and realizing how much of that marketing is targeted specifically towards moms of young children, because that is the group where fear sells the most. Because it's like, if there's any doubt in your mind as a mom that like something is bad for my child, and I can buy something better. Like, if you have the means like you're going to do it. And it's it's super frustrating, because a lot of these things aren't true. And you don't need to be spending more but really becoming a mom made me realize even more how much that marketing is targeted towards moms. Melissa Landry 13:31 Yeah, yeah, fear sells really jumped out at me. Like it can create a condition of fear. We can create status and gatekeeping these foods and there is more money to be had. So it's marketing. Erin 13:44 Yeah, for sure. And I've been in those marketing meetings, like as far as when it comes to like non GMO, organic, you know, these things aren't being put on food because like, the conversation isn't like how do we make this healthier? Oh, let's make it non GMO and organic. Like, it doesn't make it healthier. These meetings are marketing meetings, where it's like, who's our target market? Will they pay more for these labels? Okay, it makes sense to invest in these labels like they are marketing labels. They're not telling you anything about the safety or the nutrition of your food. So yeah. Dalina Soto 14:16 Crazy. Melissa I don't know if you're going to ask this or not, but like, I need to know this answer. Melissa Landry 14:23 Okay, well, I'm excited. Dalina Soto 14:25 But obviously, you say you were duped. bamboozled is my favorite word. But what made you change your mind right? Because you said you have a bachelor's in chemical engineering, right. So I'm wondering like, while you were in this Bachelor's of chemical engineering, did you believe in organic and then when were you like, wait a second, like absolutely not. Because I feel like a lot of people are still teeter tottering because again, fear sells and I was telling this to Melissa the other day, like I turned down a lot of sponsorships and like even like speaking events, because I'm like everyone refuse to speak at a conference or to you know, these people and blame them for whatever conditions happening and you're using all these fear based statements and things like that. And I 100% of against fear based public health campaigns. Melissa Landry 15:15 They don't work. Yeah, Erin 15:16 they don't work. So yeah, I mean, I, you know, specifically with chemical engineering, it was more about like, the processes, so it wasn't really, I guess, it's sounds weird, but I didn't really connect it like to food. And I think for me, it was never like, you know, I was like, Oh, I definitely know, this is healthier. For me, it was kind of just like, I can afford organic, like, it might be better. So I'm just gonna buy it. Like, it was never like, I guess it was just sort of something I did. I never really like, looked into it much. And I was just like, Yeah, I think it might be healthier. So I'm going to buy it even. So my first job out of out of college was actually at a conventional ingredient company. And I still like wasn't organic consumer, I actually ended up leaving that company to go work for a smaller, more like natural company. And that's kind of where I started realizing like how arbitrary These labels are. It was a really, really small company. So it was actually my job to get like the non GMO verifications and the organic certifications, and just sort of realizing, like, what went into that it's just like, gathering paperwork, paying them money for the label, like, kind of like questioning, like, what's the deal with this? Like, I thought this meant it was healthier. And it just seems like it's money and paperwork, and really annoying. Like, I hated getting non GMO verifications. Like it was just like, so much time, so much paperwork. And so that's kind of when I started questioning it, I would say I probably still believed a little bit. But like I said, I think it wasn't really till I had my daughter where she has some disabilities as well. And specifically, not only just being a mom being targeted by it, but being a mom of of a disabled child being targeted even more by fear based marketing, and just a lot of different things that go into that as well. You know, I was like, Okay, I'm finally going to actually like, look into the research on this and and try to understand, like, just specifically when I was like buying food for my daughter to it's like, do I need to buy organic anymore? Like, is this something I need to continue buying? And that's kind of when I started realizing a lot of the things I believed weren't necessarily what I thought they were so yeah. Melissa Landry 17:31 Well, at first, when you adopt, like an organic lifestyle, I think people do feel really empowered. Like, they found this information and they're activated and making a choice. And I love the way that it seems like through through this awakening, you like really empowered yourself, you're kind of like, wait a minute, I'm in charge. No one's gonna fear me or my kid, and we're gonna figure this out. So you kept that thread. You just did it in a different way. Yeah. Yep. That's great. So I love your videos. Like, if you are not following its food science, babe, right? Yep. Okay, you're not falling, please go follow. There's so educational. But a lot of the humor I get is in seeing, I see some some repetition and some consistency. In some of the videos, you post the way the style that they're recorded, it feels like they're often in a grocery aisle, like, come over here. Like, let's look at this label or and then there's zooming in, and there's this very particular cadence of speech and this style. And that's the part that really amuses me is like, when you watch them back to back like that. It's kind of like, what's going on here. So I guess for you like, what are some of the trends of misinformation you've seen lately? What are some of the things that seem to be popularly repeated as a fear mongering tactic among these groups? Erin 18:43 Yeah, so I think that that one specifically like where somebody goes into a grocery store, like, take something off the shelf, like reads the ingredients, and it's like, oh, this is a preservative. It's horrible. And it's just like, what like, because it's a preservative. It's horrible like, and that is the type of thing like on tick tock that I feel like creators see getting attention. So like, they'll just go do it. And it's like, they don't know what they're talking about. They didn't even understand the video they saw. And it's just like a big game of telephone where it's like, Oh, I saw like these types of videos getting all these views. So there's those ones specifically right now on tick tock. The ones that are like the banned in Europe thing is like, I've stopped even covering it because I'm just so sick of it. Like, I've done several videos on like, oh, can like do you believe what, like the US allows and what is banned in Europe, and I've gone over so many times how like regulatory, it's different in different countries. Just because an ingredient is banned in a specific country doesn't mean that it's not safe. And it's the other way around, too. I mean, the US has some ingredients that we don't have approved for food that that Europe uses and it doesn't mean that like our food is safer. Like the most frustrating thing is like we're talking about countries with Like really, really safe food supplies. And it's like we're splitting hairs and those videos like you'll just, there's just so many where people will, it's like the same three ingredients. So you know, they just like saw a video and they're like repeating it. And it's like, these things are banned in Europe and like half the time, they're not even ingredients that are banned. Like, if you look at the ingredient label in Europe, they use E numbers for additive. So it'll be like E and then a three digit number, whereas in the US, it'll say like fdmc Yellow number six or something. And so they're like, Oh, this is banned in Europe. And it's like, no, it's just labeled differently, but those ones are so prevalent right now on Tik Tok, and it's so frustrating because they get like millions of views and it's like, I've just yeah, I get tagged them all the time. And I'm just like, I'm done with this topic. I'm not covering it anymore. Like it's so frustrating. Melissa Landry 20:53 Fighting out here for 200 likes on a real I mean, come on. Erin 20:57 It's really in like I said to like all I'll make a video, you know, like, correcting it. And it's like, yeah, I get like a couple 1000 views. And I'm like, okay, cool. Melissa Landry 21:05 Yeah, like, stop stop being so unsexy and simple. Erin 21:11 Like they talk or like, I don't know, be like walking around a grocery store and doing it or something like minor too boring, I guess. I don't know. Dalina Soto 21:19 I mean, Aaron, you put on a bikini and Erin 21:25 you're doing tick tock dances. Melissa Landry 21:29 I appreciate you do it the way you want to do it. You convert it us. We're big fans. Dalina Soto 21:35 Big Big fans, and a lot out there. Melissa Landry 21:38 Did I see once that you did like a clap back or response video, and then somebody actually was like, Hey, thanks for educating me do that. Erin 21:44 Oh, yeah, that was the very first one that I did. That was like the band in Europe. So like, I was just getting started on Tik Tok. And like, I didn't really know what I was doing. But I I stitched or I do edit. I can't remember a video of somebody like that exact same video, like, did you know that these things are banned in Europe? So I just like stitched it and was like, Oh, these aren't? And then she reached out to me and actually was like, Hey, can you like, let me know? Cuz I didn't, you know, I didn't know that this was false. And so then she ended up making like a follow up video and correcting it. And that's happened a few times, but it rarely happens. Typically, I just get blocked. Dalina Soto 22:20 rarely happens, because they want to keep their likes and followers. Yeah, controversy. Erin 22:25 selling stuff that like, they're just going to block me and they don't want their followers to see it. So yeah. Melissa Landry 22:33 So I mean, like this is a lot of people like think well, okay, I get it. For the most part. Yes, we have a safe food supply. We have an FDA that has regulatory regulations, there are people involved with auditing and making sure our food supply is safe. There's this message is almost like we can trust it. But then the other side of people. But what if we can't we always do sometimes hear about the romaine lettuce that is no good, or that we hear about this would be like a infection kind of situation. But how do we stay open to new science and new phenomena, while also honoring the side? That's like, it's mostly safe. So what can people do to like, be skeptical enough? Erin 23:16 Yeah, so I think like those things have, like, you know, the recalls and stuff. I mean, that's those are our processes working. I mean, like, we have processes in place to like, understand if something gets out that needs to be recalled, and it gets recalled. Like, that is how that those processes work. And so I think sometimes, like people will use examples like that, and it's like, or like something that was approved in the past that's now banned. And it's like, that's evidence of it, of it working and, you know, taking new evidence into account and realizing like, we do learn new information all the time. So like, there are potentially going to be things like in the future that, you know, or we just come up with a safer alternative. And so it's like, Hey, we're not going to use this anymore. But I think a lot of times, those get brought up as like examples of like, oh, we can't trust the system. Whereas like, those are actually like, those are examples of this system actually working. Like, that's how it works. Like, they take new evidence into account. And if something eventually is like, hey, or they need to alter the levels that are approved to so that's one thing, you know, those are examples of the system working. The other thing too, is like, I think a lot of times when people are just like, there's no regulations surrounding this, it's like they just don't know, they literally never looked at the regulations. And it's like, if you go into the CFR and actually look at the regulations surrounding that, it's like very regulated. So I think a lot of times too, it's like they're just sort of like repeating something they've heard and they've they've never gone and actually looked at the regulations and it's like, no, if you actually go look, I mean, it's very regulated. So I think I think it's two thing is just like one people not really actually going and looking at the regulations. Before stating like, oh, there's no regulations, like anything goes, additives go through a process to be approved, and a lot of them to have specific levels that can be in foods based on toxicology data. And so these things, you know, it's not just like, oh, we can put whatever we want into whatever we want, at whatever amount that we want. I mean, there's definitely regulations, and they keep getting better, you know, as we get more evidence to so yeah, Melissa Landry 25:28 yeah, I love that framing, right. It's true. And I talk about this with clients, sometimes who struggle with the idea of food waste. And I always think back to whenever we did our part. dietetics training is also like food service management. Angelina might remember this, but they make you learn these calculations, like, if you're going to make broccoli, there's a yield of 70% in the broccoli or something like that. So for me, I was like, oh, okay, so there's always going to be a part of the broccoli that won't get used. And that helped me to understand that food waste is inherently part of food production, we can aspire and work towards reducing that as much as possible, but it may never be zero. And you're making me think that that's also a helpful like frame for food safety, like, it may never be at zero, because these are organic materials where bacteria and viruses, they can grow we can we're learning new things as we improve technology, and the expectation that food will be 100% safe, is almost like that's how people expect it to be. But that's not the reality of working with biological material. Erin 26:32 Yeah, yep. Yeah. And like you said, like we're do we figure out ways to make food safer all the time, but that it's never going to be like, you know, there's never going to be a recall, or it's 100% safe, like, there's always going to be those things that happen. But, you know, overall, it is getting safer. And we're figuring out ways to make food, you know, even last longer to reduce food waste, and things like that. And to so yeah, Melissa Landry 26:57 And feed more people, I think that's the right thing. You know, we think from the folks who maybe are more privileged are demanding all of this, these extra bells and whistles, the progress that we have made has helped with food insecurity, it has helped people who are have less means access food that maybe wouldn't have been able to. And so we have to think about all of us, not just the privileged few when we're developing a food supply, Erin 27:23 Right. And that's the thing I get really frustrated with is like the demonizing of like preservatives, especially, I mean, like, for some reason, like they just haven't, like this negative connotation, like you literally just say, like something is a preservative. And it's like, implied that that's negative. Well, you know, it is it's, it's, it's improving access, and, you know, reducing food waste and making food safer. And it's like, why is that implied like negative like, in typically it is coming from people that like, they don't need those foods. So they're just like, well just buy fresh, and it's like, cool if you can do that, but like a lot of people can't and it's great that they have canned, frozen, you know, vegetables because they literally wouldn't have access otherwise. So it's super frustrating to see that being, you know, demonized when the access literally isn't there for some people, and that is a way to get them food, you know, and yeah, Dalina Soto 28:20 and I mean, like, this is the number one thing that trolls come into my page about is preservatives in Sasol. And I'm just like, Melissa Landry 28:31 oh, come for the season if Dalina Soto 28:34 me now and it's like the number one thing that people are always like fucked up preservatives. And sodium is a natural preservative, right? Like I don't like I don't know how else to explain this to you. But like sodium is gonna be found inside so not only because it adds flavor, but because it's a preservative so that your seasonings can stay fresh longer so that you can utilize it because not all of us can make stuff on on our own right right. It is literally you can go on literally any post that I have ever made about any Latinx food and that is literally a comment on everything. So you are okay with preservatives? Yes I am. Erin 29:17 Yeah Melissa Landry 29:18 Selena I'm gonna start coming to each one of your posts and just saying stop supporting big preservatives. Dalina Soto 29:24 Oh, don't get me started I just blocked somebody yesterday. Melissa Landry 29:28 I'm like I'm gonna be like conspiracy question mark is deleted involved with says Dalina Soto 29:33 so how can you how can you believe in the health block block I'm blessed that hashtag block unblock? Melissa Landry 29:42 It seems to be the mental health strategy. So yeah, yeah. So really important perspective. And I'm hoping listeners who maybe feel on the fence about this. feel inspired at least when you see something that isn't matching what you think just taking a pause, take a breath. Look at the information, Aaron's pages Fantastic if you're looking for little bite size pieces of information to get your mind open to this, what would you say Aaron is like your bit of advice or takeaway you'd want listeners to think about if they are a little bit skeptical. They come from a clean eating camp. And they they also are working on liberalizing food rules and wanting food freedom. So from your perspective, what would you suggest? Erin 30:22 Yeah, I mean, I guess the first thing is just being open to questioning your biases, like you're not, you're not going to learn anything, or change your beliefs until you're until you're open. I mean, there were a lot of opportunities for me that I was like, just not ready yet. So I think just being open and realizing like questioning, if these are things you're just believing, and you haven't really like, looked at the evidence, like realizing like, these aren't things that are just like, common sense type things, necessarily. So just looking at the, you know, the evidence base info I present, I think it's really important to like, if there are accounts that you follow, that are making you feel bad about the food you're eating, or making you feel like what you're eating is, like harmful, or what you're just like, constantly telling you like, what you're feeding your kids is harmful, like unfollowing those accounts to is really helpful. Because, like we've said, like, our food is very safe, you shouldn't be scared of safe foods and a lot of that fear, you know, the fear mongering, and the misinformation is based off of fear. And I think constantly seeing that in your newsfeed, you know, toxins is a huge, like red flag word, if people are saying something is toxic, and they're not telling you anything about like, you know, specifically naming the chemical, they're talking about talking about dose or giving you any sort of scientific evidence showing that it's toxic. That's a word that gets thrown around so much. And it's it's meaningless unless you're backing it up with more information. And so I think just making sure you're, I think that's a good news resolution, too, is just like going through your newsfeed. If account. Yeah, like if accounts are constantly saying like, this is toxic, or, you know, this is harming your kid, like, just stop following those accounts, because they're really not helpful and they can be really harmful to so yeah, Dalina Soto 32:17 I will also add that a lot of the studies that they cite are rat studies. Yeah, I'm just gonna put that out there. Erin 32:23 One other thing too, it's difficult to tell people what to look for. Because a lot of times, I'm like, make sure they're citing studies. But now I know that there's accounts out there that are like, have a long list of studies. And I'll go look at them. And I'm like, Okay, first of all that like, literally has nothing to do with your post. You know, it's a rat study. It's a, you know, it's a small study, cherry pick studies. So I think it's important to like, I feel I feel like a lot of these, like pseudoscience accounts are kind of catching on to like, oh, we need to cite our sources. So they'll like have a huge list. And most people will look at that and be like, Oh, they have references, so it's legit, but you have to go a step further and like, look at what they're referencing to. So yeah, Dalina Soto 33:03 It can be very frustrating and hard and overwhelming. So take a step back and just take some deep breaths and saying, I'm just gonna do what's right for me right now at this moment, and maybe I'll come back to that later because it is a scary world. Melissa Landry 33:18 Yeah, definitely. Sure. Well, thank you for those tips. And I know that you you've got some like merch, I think you have a Patreon tell us how can folks find you and support your work? Erin 33:30 Yeah, so Facebook, Instagram, Tik Tok. It's all food science, baby. And then I have a patreon for anybody that wants to I do twice a month live q&a is for my Patreon members. So they kind of get to pick what topics that they want me to talk about. And I do like a half an hour live q&a for them. And then I also have a merch store, which you can find linked on any one of my pages, but I have some designs that I made up So Melissa Landry 33:55 Erin, once you got in that merch store, you got some T shirts. Erin 33:59 I have some Yeah, I need to actually create some new designs. I haven't created any for a while but I'll need a mug. Yeah, there's there's mugs. There's T shirts. Yeah. Yeah. Melissa Landry 34:09 My sister does sometimes listen to this podcast. And if she does, she's gonna laugh. I cannot figure out what to get her. At the time of this recording holidays are upon us. You'll be hearing it in January. So maybe maybe she's gonna get some food sides, baby. Yeah. No, Christmas presents. Aaron, you're so awesome. I love your story. I love the way you teach and that you like our listeners have gone through a bit of changing and evolving around food freedom and really kind of honoring your body and your values. So thank you so much for being here and for sharing your story. Erin 34:44 Thank you so much for having me, everybody and Melissa Landry 34:47 that was a really fun one. I enjoyed the Clean Eating deep dive Dalina Soto 34:52 Listen. So good. Like, I can't even Melissa Landry 34:58 talk about the kids say I can't eat them. But can't even she's overloaded, overloaded? I think it's helpful. It's tough to take it in. And I was listening to that podcast maintenance phase this morning. And sometimes it's a little bit like, oh, gosh, there's so much misinformation out there. And it's hard. It's hard not to get swept up in it. So I think it's always helpful to have that calm perspective from people like Aaron who can say, You know what, yeah, for the most part, you can feel safe to eat how you want that actually is, it's backed by science. I think a lot of people feel afraid of it at first, because we're told, like, you have to be afraid of everything. Dalina Soto 35:41 And that's the thing. Like, it's such a fear based everything. It's just like nothing like we need to talk about a lot of things when we talk about risk. And it's not always just fear. Melissa Landry 35:52 I don't know. Well, for our clients anyways, clean eating is a subset of my clients were clean eating is definitely their entry point. Yeah, they're disordered stuff. And, oh, God, it feels frustrating when they look back, because they're like, I wasted so much time and energy and money. I was so anxious around food. And if only I had known that, that wasn't really coming from a place of my best interest and might have done different so it's just good perspective to have is you're challenging those food rules. Dalina Soto 36:21 It is and you have to do what's right for you and your body. Ultimately, that's the goal. Melissa Landry 36:28 Yeah, we just want you to have those facts and information inside. Well, we at the time of this recording, about to take a little bit of a break. It's entering into that holiday season. Yeah, for some time off. Listen, I'm ready to just lay and do nothing. She's in her sweats already. I can see you're not there. We're like overly formal dresses as it is. I would say that. What is the delineation between vacation and work weeks for us in that regard? Sometimes we dress up some desert dress down, but I had a great year recording with you. I can't wait to get back at it. Of course you guys will be listening to this way. Yeah, vacation. They were rested and jolly on Instagram. Yeah, we want to thank you for being with us. Listening to these podcasts, hopefully inspiring your journey out there. If you get a second, we would love for you to give us an honest review. Tell us how the podcast is impacting you. We love supporting you with this information. So let us know how you're using it out there. Dalina Soto 37:27 So connect with us and peace, love and break the diet cycle. Melissa Landry 37:33 Adelina. Dalina Soto 37:34 Bye Transcribed by https://otter.ai